Introduction 0:03
Welcome to the Elevate Your Equity podcast where we, as married busy professionals, leverage real estate investing to unlock the three plus one degrees of freedom, health, location, time and financial.

Derek Clifford 0:16
Today, we are honored to have a high flying very active real estate investor, Mr. Tim Vest on the program. Tim, how are you today?

Tim Vest 0:25
Doing well, Derek, thanks for having me on, man. And thanks for that intro. High flying. I love it.

Derek Clifford 0:30
Yeah, high flying is just kind of off the cuff. I know that we’re not in an airplane or either one of us are right now. But that’s the only way that I can describe all the success you’ve had recently. And for those people who do not know Tim, Tim has been in the business for 15 years. And he’s done it all from partnering with developers to developing raw land and purchasing and investing in single family rentals, fix and flips, multifamily, and hotels. And he’s currently the owner partner in multiple apartment communities outside of his passion for real estate. Tim also enjoyed a 20 plus year career in technology, and then founded multiple startups. So we’re talking with someone with a very diverse background. And also you know what, Tim, I gotta be honest with you, it makes me feel real good that I’m sharing the industry that you have chose after such a very strong and probably dynamic career. So now I know that I’m in the right place. Let’s put it that way.

Tim Vest 1:27
Yeah, you know, you know, it’s interesting. It’s funny that you say that as I was, I saw somebody I saw a list yesterday, it was like, it was around net worth or something. It was one of those just kinda like brainless moments where you’re just reading something. And it was crazy how many it was crazy how many folks like for instance, Bonner? Like, I don’t know, everybody’s interested in YouTube or whatever. Bano. bado is a a very diverse real estate investor. And I was in there was a list, you know, there was like a 20 person list. And I think 11 Out of the 20 people on that list were real estate investors. And I was just like, yeah, that’s pretty good company to be in. Really good.

Derek Clifford 2:08
I love it. I love it. There’s that statistic out there, Tim that says that. What is it 90%? Or no, not maybe not 90, but a majority, a vast majority of the millionaires out there for many years have gotten their wealth or kept their wealth because of real estate in some degree or compassionate capacity. So we are definitely in some good company for sure.

Tim Vest 2:28
Yeah, no kidding. A you know, it’s good company to be in. And, you know, when I when I first started doing some of this stuff, I came across, I came across a guy like one of the one of the first guys I ever tried to raise money from right talking about trying to hit a home run swing, this guy was worth, I think at the time, he was worth $320 million. And I was just chatting with him. I was like, How’d you do it? And he was like, man, I was an accountant and the guys in his 80s. And he’s like, I was an accountant up in New York. And I just kept noticing every one of my wealthiest clients had real estate and real estate and real estate. He’s like, Man, I gotta buy some real estate. And he started buying real estate in Baltimore, Baltimore, Baltimore, fast forward 40 years, the guy free and clear on $320 million, with a real real estate. And, you know, I was like, that’s, I think that’s where I would want to play.

Derek Clifford 3:21
That is awesome. I love that. I love that. I love that distilled knowledge and the unfair advantage you get as being a real as a not a realtor, but a real, real estate focused accountant, who gets to see all these people with their net worths climbing every single year, you know, must be an interesting perspective to see it from and you kind of scratch your head and you’re wondering, well, gee, why and I do. And then I love that it’s a great thing. But, you know, let’s back up and start at the very beginning, like we like to with all of our guests, right? You have had a really diverse career. And, you know, you’ve selected real estate as one of the places for you to expand on over the past 1520 years. And so, can you talk a little bit about where you got that spark back then, for real estate investing and kind of how that’s propelled you to where you are today?

Tim Vest 4:09
Yeah, so you know, a couple of things. My, my family, long history in the in North Carolina, family farm dating back to the early 1800s. So land real estate, you know, was always a big thing, because, you know, way back when you really measured your net worth and land, you know, and and that’s, that’s absolutely how my great grandfather did it, you know, and, you know, when he lost some of it during the Great Depression, that was a big blow to him, you know, and I remember my grandfather and even my uncle, now, you know, spending time like recouping going back and purchasing what he had lost, you know, in that at that time, and that was a big deal to them. Had another uncle that I remember growing up, he basically owned the entire downtown area of the small small town that they lived in. And, and I just remember thinking, Man, that’s cool. like you own this building, that’s cool, you know, and I think there was a bank in it at the time. And I was like, that’s really cool Oscar, you own this thing. And so that was always kind of in my head. And then, you know, my dad was always big into land. And then one of the things that really stuck with me is when I was in college, I worked my way through school, and I worked at a law firm, and the senior partner, this guy, Howard, he looked at me on the criminal graduation party, and he looked at me, he goes, I can give you one piece of advice, buy as much real estate as you can. And at the time, you know, as a, as a 22 year old knowing all right, and I was like, whatever, I got a job, I got a job, they offered me 31 Five, I’m gonna go off and make my 31 baht. It’d be good. But you know, that always kind of stuck with me. And then around 2005 2006, I started, I started the job, you know, you know, making good money in it, you know, had discretionary income ran into a couple of guys who had the same thing. And they were doing real estate. They were buying real estate. And I was just like, Man, I want to let’s talk about that. So we partnered up, got into some some land flips and stuff and you know, been doing it ever since. You know, that’s kind of where it all started.

Derek Clifford 6:17
And if you don’t mind sharing with the audience, what does your portfolio look like today? Because you know, you’ve got raw land stuff, development, single families flips multifamily. What is your portfolio approximately look like?

Tim Vest 6:30
Yeah, I’m I am primarily focused in multifamily. Now, I do have some mixed use where I do have a couple of commercial retail commercial spots, but mostly came across those because there happens to be apartments upstairs, and there just was some commercial on the bottom. But I’m highly focused on multifamily. In, you know, between, between my own stuff that I actively manage, we’re right around 600 units, as far as GP LP types of opportunities, just north of 1100 units total managed and invested in.

Derek Clifford 7:08
Yeah, that’s incredible. So I mean, I know, you’ve had a very long career. But I know for the past couple of years, your trajectory has just completely skyrocketed. We were talking about that before we hit the record button here today. But you know, before we talk about that a little bit later on in the show, I want to ask you, let’s go back to some of the early days, and maybe this transition away from the point in time where you’re working w two and then you’re transitioning, you know, that side hustle, period, right? Where you’re kind of doing stuff in the middle, and then you’re you’re off doing this full time. Can you talk about the skills, you’re able to redeploy, from both your entrepreneurial ventures and your full time gigs, into real estate investing for inspiration for the audience?

Tim Vest 7:47
Yeah, a couple of things. You know, as I was coming up through my IT career, one, a lot of that was just a lot of that was consulting and customer facing. So I had a lot of experience going into job sites going into other people’s companies. And quite frankly, doing a lot of kind of what they called Red team work, when projects were in trouble going in and pulling them out of trouble. So I had a lot of experience kind of just working through problems, right, working through problems working with customers, to focus on problems and work through them. And that’s, that’s certainly something that we do in the real estate world, for sure. And then the other thing that I would say is, is team building, being able to scale and team building people process and putting those in place, those are, that was kind of where I got to, in my, in my career that I really, really focused on an Excel that is I was able to build really, really high performing efficient teams that, quite frankly, didn’t need me to run in which actually helped me in the transition phase. But that I would say, those are probably two of the biggest places, you know, I’m Jose now I’m able to go in and you know, when our team gets really, really frustrated about something or whatever, and you know, people have a tendency to focus on the problem, and not the solution. Right? And, you know, I’m able and you know, even going through that right now, it’s like, Hey, guys, that’s the problem, right? We’ve identified the problem, let’s do the solution and the plan to get there, and let’s make a decision and move forward. And it’s kind of that ability to keep the ball rolling and keep the progress going, no matter how small that I’ve found has been one of my biggest assets in the real estate world. You know, even even today, you know, we just got off the partner call this morning and got a couple of most of our stuffs doing well but you know, as you know, if you get enough of it, there’s going to be always that one that’s that’s kind of lagging behind. And, you know, we had a conversation about that, like, problem solution or a solution. Let’s go. Yeah, you know,

Derek Clifford 9:56
if we don’t have problems, then there’s we’re doing something wrong and The other thing that I wanted to talk to just real quick, just make a comment on this and we can move on is how you said that, you know what, as these problems come up, you get to rely on your team, if there’s a problem, you need to find a solution and get it done, right? I think that what gets missed in a lot of things is a problem comes up. And sometimes you often quickly jump to a solution, thinking that that’s the right solution. But it may not be that the good thing is, is that if you have a team, there’s most likely a better chance because you have more eyeballs looking at the same time that you’re going to have a better solution that is actually rooted in the why right? You’re gonna have a solution that says, Why is this happening, right? Because a lot of people will get the problem and they’ll say, let’s just get this fixed. But you have to understand what is causing the problem. So you can cut that the root. And if you have a team who is well versed at doing something like that, or has experience, then you shortcut all of that. So it truly is as simple as problem solution process. But you know, I just want to flag out there to some of the investors who are maybe flying solo, right? Take a little bit of extra time, take a breath, right, take the afternoon, and try to figure out what the true cause of the problem is, before you diagnose and grunted solution.

Tim Vest 11:13
Yeah, and to great, really good point and to like, even if you don’t have a team, if you’re flying solo, don’t don’t hesitate. Right. When you think you have that solution, don’t hesitate to call somebody, you know, and just say, Hey, can I run this by what do you think? And, you know, don’t get caught in that analysis paralysis, right. But, but at the same time, you know, like you said, it’s always good to get that second set of eyes, and let somebody play devil’s advocate with you for a second. And then you know, okay, cool. All right. It’s well, let’s go. You know,

Derek Clifford 11:43
I love it. I love it. Yeah, I couldn’t agree with you more. So over your career, you’ve already touched on the fact that you’ve explored many different sectors of commercial real estate and even residential real estate. Can you talk us through your decision making? So how you went from land, entitlement or land flipping to single families to commercial, whatever it is, you know, between A to Z? How did you get through all of those? And what made you looking back? What was the common thread that helped force you change or pivot through each of those adjustments?

Tim Vest 12:15
Oh, the common thread was just learning lessons, right? learning lessons, applying and moving forward and adjusting. Now what, what what made me learn those lessons were different things, you know, with the landflip thing, I would say 2008 came along and just taught me that lesson. That was, and I’m sure I’m not the first guy to tell you that. And so you know, land flips, the land flips are beautiful. And by the way, guys, they’re extremely popular right now. In fact, in fact, I think Derek, you and I are in a group, or we know a group that’s doing a lot with land flips. But yeah, land flips are very, very popular right now. They were popular back then. Now the problem with landflip stores, sometimes when you get into them, they don’t cash flow. They’re they’re all about sale, price acquisition, sell price. And, you know, when when you get into something like that, and something like 2008 comes along, and you don’t have cash flow in your runways real short. So that was a lesson in 2008. Moving into 2011, it was like, Okay, I’m gonna go find things that cash flow. So I started doing fix and flips. And you know, like, every, every three flips, I’d flip to keyboard, right? And build some cash flow, build some cash flow, the things I was keeping, I was building cash flow. Now, the lesson from that was around 2018, I looked at this and said, Man, I’ve really built a job for myself, that doesn’t scale very well. So I need to own a rethink that part of it. And I had been, I’ve done very well, but I wanted to rethink that part of it. Like, how can I scale beyond this? And, you know, I looked at a lot of different things, but it just kind of, you know, you have that aha moment, and it’s like, how do I get more tenants under one roof? Right, and oh, yeah, multifamily. So, you know, kind of sold off as that portfolio moved into multifamily. So, I would say lessons learned as the common thread how I learned those lessons. Those were different at different times.

Derek Clifford 14:29
Yeah, very well said. And I think that, you know, for a lot of people out there, I want you guys to be aware that to be successful like Tim, you know, I can’t remember where exactly I heard this. Maybe it was in LA it was, it was it was in some book that I read recently, I reread. But if you were to take a plane from Los Angeles, or maybe Seattle to Miami, right, that plane, believe it or not, we’ll be exactly on course, only 2% of the time or 3% of the time. It’s all about these little adjustments. And the journey itself. And so you know, from what I’ve learned from Tim here is that this journey is a constant evolution, you’re always looking to pivot. And if you know what your end goal is, you can at least set your sail in that direction and just trust that you’ll make the right decisions to move and make adjustments. So I love that the first lesson was, you know, it’s 2008, you have macroeconomic forces at work. And then the second thing, which is like the Black Swan type of thing, and then the second thing is, you got a job for yourself, but not really a business. And so well, actually a business, but it’s mostly a job for yourself. And so those two lessons are very important. Probably took you a long time to learn. But now you have them. They’re part of you now. And I think that you’ve been able to leverage those beautifully to where you are at this point. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Yeah. So next point I want to talk about was mindset. Okay. Now, I know that we, you know, in our, in our form that we send out to all of our podcast guests, we ask what your superpower is, and you put in there very curiously, a willingness to fail. And I thought that was really fascinating. And what I want to talk about now is a circle around this point a lot, because there’s a lot here to unpack. I want to talk about how much of your success would you attribute to your ability or willingness to be able to fail? And move on after that?

Tim Vest 16:26
I would say almost all of it, honestly. You know, that there’s a there’s a popular, there’s a proper quote out there, and I’m gonna paraphrase it. And I think I said something about it this week. It’s, you know, Muhammad Ali always said, you know, I’ve never lost a fight by getting knocked down, I only lose what they don’t get up, right? Oh, man, I’ve always, and I’ve always kind of taken that to heart. And, and I used to say the different way to my teams, right, I had teams and my guys would sit in rooms sometimes. And they would just, they would just get stuck, they would get stuck. They’d have three decisions in front of them, and they get stuck. And when you really, really dug into it, it’s like Guys, why? Why are we struggling? You have three options here. Why are you struggling? Well, we don’t want to be wrong, we don’t want to fail. I’m like, the biggest the biggest failure you can make right now is not making a decision. You know that that’s failure, that, you know, I always told them. And you know, some jobs are a little different, right? I always used to say, Guys, we’re not doing heart surgery, right? Nobody dies if we make the wrong decision. So here, just pick one, move forward. If it doesn’t work, guess what, that’s not failure, we’ve actually eliminated an option. We learned something and eliminated an option. Now we can go see if one of the other options based on what we just learned off that are more likely to succeed. So I think that’s just kind of it. Right? Like, you know, I’ve always kind of said, the worst thing you can do is just stand in fear, right? Don’t be afraid to fail. And don’t look at it as failure, right? What’s the other one? Like failures, just success training or something like that? I think that’s the other one. Yeah. And I know, we’re throwing out little like, you know, weird phrases or whatever, but they’re true. I mean, they’re true, they really are like failures is failure is just learning how to succeed.

Derek Clifford 18:17
Yep. Yeah, I was gonna say sorry, for sorry for jumping in there. But I was just gonna say that that Muhammad Ali quote that you mentioned, is super powerful, because it very much is the case. And that’s what I really want the listeners to understand here, especially coming from someone who has gone through so many different experiences on the tech side. And I guess, in a law firm, also, apparently, in the early days as well, is that you know, you should not be afraid to fail. As a matter of fact, the way that I look at it, and I want to get your comment on this is you don’t know what your true capacity is, unless you face your fears and fail, right? If you try something. So you know, if you don’t face your fears, and push the bounds of what you’re capable of doing by facing that resistance and potentially failure, how will you ever get anywhere? How will you ever achieve anything that’s worth doing? So I’m just wanting to hear your comments on that. If that if you found that to be the case? Or if that’s a good way to look at it as well.

Tim Vest 19:11
Yeah, I think it’s a great way to look at it. You know, because one of the one of the biggest things for me is like, I never, I never want to be 75 years old, looking back and saying what if, right, like I just, I just want to know, like, Hey, I tried, it didn’t work out, got punched in the face a little bit. But you know, at the end of the day, I’m still here. And I know, I know, that wasn’t for me, right? So that’s, I think that’s just kind of how I do things is, you know, I just want to I just want to give them a shot and never kind of wonder what if I had mattered or not, you know? So,

Derek Clifford 19:48
I want to talk about how your mindset has evolved over your career. Right? Can you if you can, I know this is probably a tall ask, but you know, maybe just infer what you think that you would have answered back in the day. But what does the word failure mean now versus what it probably meant to you when you first got started? And how has your mindset evolved?

Tim Vest 20:12
Oh, that’s a good one. That’s a good one. Um, I think one of the things, I think one of the things for me where it’s changed is, you know, I thought there was a very clear path on how you did things, right. Like you graduated high school, you went to college, you graduated college, you got a job. You spent what, however many years going through the corporate routine, right. And I think I think I had a mindset of that’s how it worked. Even though even though I knew in the back of my head, that’s not what I wanted to do. Like I was, I met some great people had some great managers, great bosses and stuff like that. But I was miserable in the corporate setting. absolutely miserable. And I think that’s probably but but I always for for a while, I just said, Well, this is just how it is, this is what you do. Right? This is what you do. And I think that’s probably one of the biggest mindset shifts I had is at some point, I was like, wait a minute, it doesn’t have to be like this. And you know, that that group that I mentioned earlier, I think the fact that they you know, having that mindset of abundance, rather than scarcity was a big shift for me, right? I think when I kind of stopped looking at it as, where’s my deck next dollar coming from? And started to look at things more of like, there’s plenty out there, go grab it. And, you know, I think I think that’s where I think that’s where it really shifted for me is at that moment, like I started, I always thought I always thought like, where’s the next dollar coming from? And then it started, I started to realize I was like, man, there’s, it’s actually not that hard. You just gotta put, you just got to put a plan in place, but the effort behind it and make consistent effort and progress towards that, and it kind of starts to take care of itself. It really does.

Derek Clifford 21:58
I love it. And do you? Can you peg a certain moment in time where you made that realization from scarcity to abundance, or at least became aware of it?

Tim Vest 22:08
We’re at a specific point in time. Um, I think I think one of my first little startups was probably it. I had, this was on an IT startup, I had a little apparel company. And I started to notice that like, hey, if I did this money came in, I did this, I made some money. If I did this, I made some money. If I treated people, right, I made some money, you know, that kind of thing. And that’s where I, that’s where I started to realize I was like, you know, it’s really not that hard. You know, it’s really not that hard. And, you know, maybe there’s folks that are listening to this that have a different, you know, idea on that, but that’s just been my experience, you know, it hasn’t been that hard. And please don’t, please don’t mistake that for you don’t have to work hard. Because, you know, it did. There’s, there’s there were there were and there still are a lot of you know, 1214 16 hour days, yesterday was a 17 hour day. There’s still a lot of that going on. But you know, you know, like, like, one of my mentors said, he’s like, being poor is hard. You know, and, you know, hustling is hard. He’s like, choose your heart. Right. And but, you know, there are lots of ways to make income, there’s lots of ways to make money, legally. And, and, you know, it’s really, there’s tons of options out there. And once you kind of realize that, I think it frees you up a little bit.

Derek Clifford 23:36
Yeah, this is very, very well said, um, do you? Do you have any advice out there for people who are maybe struggling with this flip? Like, they’re probably listening to you right now and saying, Look, you know, I hear you, but I don’t I don’t get it, that there’s abundance out there. Maybe someone who’s listening right now is stuck in the scarcity read, or maybe they’re very much attuned to just saying, Well, you know, if someone makes $1, then I lose one. And that’s a that’s that’s a fallacy, as we know, because money flows where effort goes, one of my favorite books, The Richest Man in Babylon kind of explains all this, right? From a very ancient type of perspective, that those principles are still valid today, and wherever value is created, that’s where money goes. So what would you say to people who, like us that are stuck in this scarcity loop? And maybe you can help them elevate their their mindset there?

Tim Vest 24:29
Yeah, so I don’t have anything earth shattering there. I’m gonna I’m gonna be honest with you, but I’ll go back to kind of like one of the things that that that a guy that we probably both know Devin elder, Oh, yeah. That one? Yeah. Great guy. Kind of said one time that kind of was like an aha moment for me. And it’s so simple, though. Right? It’s so simple. He’s like, I don’t think you really need as much as you think you need. You know, I don’t think you need as much as you think you need and he’s like, just Just go through your finances and look, right. So I sat down and I was like, you know, he’s right. Like if I actually just want to pay the mortgage and put food on the table, I really don’t need that much. And that that was an aha moment for me that kind of made me realize like things aren’t first of all, they aren’t as scarce as I thought they were. And I didn’t need as much as I thought I did. But then that I think that other moment for me was kind of just a shift of, and I don’t know this, that actually answers the question. But I, it was kind of a shift for me of like, what is really scarce versus abundant and stuff like that? And how is it all? How does it all apply to, to what makes me happy, right? Because, because what I did know is I was miserable in the corporate world, and I was making very good money. But my time, most of my time was spent being miserable. And the only thing I didn’t know, that was scarce was my time, right? Like, time was scarce. And so I was like, I can’t continue to be miserable, because I’ve only got so much of this, right. So at some point, I just kind of let you know what the money is gonna take care of itself. However, that looks and I’m just gonna go out there and kind of do my own thing. So I don’t know that that’s really good advice, other than maybe just a reset of priorities.

Derek Clifford 26:17
Yeah, you know, I, I will disagree with you there. I think that that’s awesome advice. And, you know, a couple of things that I want to also add to the audience is, and Tim alluded to this earlier, get a good group of people who can challenge you. And secondly, live in gratitude, take stock of the fact that you’re healthy, and even able to have the opportunity to listen to us Converse today. Right? And that you’re in a state of mind where you can focus on growing yourself, instead of having to survive, like focusing on survival, where your next meal is gonna come from, right. Because let’s face it, most people in the United States or North America in general, have a lot of great things going for us. And so if you live in that abundance, and do an audit of people that are injecting negative energy into your life, I think you’re gonna start to find that you should find yourself very grateful. And you’ll start thinking more abundantly. So I just wanted to add those two points and see if you agree there too with that.

Tim Vest 27:11
Yeah, I agree. And I think you brought up something there like bait, that kind of positive energy, that kind of positive energy thing you mentioned before, like adding value in the money will come that in itself is a huge value. Because because I think one of the things for me, is we’re talking about scarcity versus abundance is, you know, having a mindset shift, mindset shift from, from transactional, to more strategic, you know, and, you know, because I think sometimes there’s a, there’s a tendency to say how much I need to get everything I can out of this transaction, rather than, okay, you know, if I gave, if I gave, if I gave a little bit today, and made it easy and just came, you know, just was just easy to work with, and just positive vibes, whatever, right? And, and didn’t try to get everything out of Derek for this one particular bill, then Derek’s probably going to be like, you know, Tim was pretty easy to work with, I got this other thing. Let me go back to him. It doesn’t happen all the time. It’s not always that way. But for me, it has been more it has been, it has been true more often than not, you know, I, I still have that little apparel company. And I haven’t asked for a customer or sought a customer in probably eight years. Yet, I still have plenty of business coming in on that. And it’s all because I’ve always treated my customers like that. I’ve never tried to get every nickel out of them. And they just like Tim’s easy. Let me go continue working with him. And I’m seeing it in the real estate world as well.

Derek Clifford 28:40
Absolutely. Now, I couldn’t help but notice this too. And again, I think everything you said is spot on. But now I have a tally in my head. That’s for industries that Tim is invested in or is interested in. That’s incredible, man, that’s awesome. Just what a little sidebar there. But I want to shift a little bit more and move into what things are like right now. Okay. Most likely this podcast will be coming out the edge of q3 or q4 2022. So understand that what Tim says here is not a financial prediction. So please, you know, make sure you consult with your attorneys or your financial planners, anyone that you trust with your finances, including yourself your own education, but I want to ask you is and we’re gonna get into more like you know, current stuff right now, but your mindset, right? Can you describe how important mindset is for investing in a time like this right now? In q3, q4, of 2022.

Tim Vest 29:37
Yeah, we’re gonna see how this ages right.

Derek Clifford 29:40
It’s timeless. I’m sure it’s gonna be timeless for sure.

Tim Vest 29:43
Yeah, good question. So, how is my house mindset and important right now? Um, I think it’s extremely important. I think keeping perspective is completely important. You know, especially when you know the the big talk right now. Well in real estate is, is, is rates, right? You know, and rates are going up and they’re going up and they’re going up. And, you know, I think keeping perspective is really important to like making sure you get the right right mindset, I’m still very aggressive, I’m still very aggressive, I see this as a really good time to buy, because one seller expectations are shifting. And, you know, the, the idea that I can, I can sell my property for more tomorrow than I did, then then I got for it today is kind of going back a little bit. So it’s helping negotiations, it’s hope and helping with opening the door for for actually having a negotiation. So my mindset right now is very aggressive. And part of that, too, is because of perspective, right? Like, I think people get used to those 3% interest rates, and lost sight of the fact that five and 6%, it’s really not that expensive, and it’s not abnormal. In fact, historically, it’s actually still pretty low. And so I don’t have a problem at five and 6%. And I also have always kept, you know, regardless of what’s going on today, I’ve always seen real estate as a long term investment. You know, it’s a long term investment. I know, we got used to those quick flips, I even flipped for a while. I know, we got used to that I know we got used to buying, you know, a 20 unit or 80 unit property in 2019. And then turn it around and selling it at the end of 2024 or beginning of 2021 for, you know, a 40% markup, you know, stuff like that. I knew we get used to that. But that’s not normal. And real. estate’s always been a long term play in my head, I look at it and go, Hey, if I can get it today, and the numbers work, and it cash flows today, I’m happy to buy it and sit on it for 10 years. So when I keep that perspective, I don’t really honestly, I don’t really worry too much about what’s exactly happening today.

Derek Clifford 32:02
That’s awesome. Yeah, I couldn’t agree with you more there. I think the fact that as long as you get debt that is more or less fixed or has caps right in place, you’re going to see yourself winning in this inflationary environment as well. So yes, interest rates are low seller expectations are shifting. We have you know, inflation running rampant right now, because of supply chain things not a, it’s, it doesn’t seem like it’s stagflation, which is a really good thing. At least that’s what a lot of the economists are saying here in q3 of 2022. But yeah, I couldn’t, I couldn’t agree with you more, Tim, and I think this is a perfect time to buy. So for all of you out there that are waiting for 2008 style recession, please don’t, please don’t do that to jump in. Because if you can find the right property and keep the perspective, like what Tim was saying, you can find a great deal and just focus on value addition, right, like just getting good fundamentals in place, get fixed term debt for, you know, the near term, five years, seven years, 10 years, if you can get agency and focus on adding value, and let inflation do the rest. Right. Get good 10 good fundamentals, and you’re all set.

Tim Vest 33:08
Yeah, and that is a great point. That’s a great point. Because, yeah, people who jumped in in 2008, there, they did, hey, congrats, good job. I told myself in 2008 not doing this again, I’m gonna be on the other side, right? Like, I learned a lesson, right? But go ask somebody today, if something they bought in 2004 2005, that they still have today. Ask them if, if, if they’re if they regret it, if they regret buying it to know, four to five another way, they guarantee you, they’re not going to tell you? Yes, I regret that decision. So, you know, just keep that in mind. Right? That was a bump. That was a bump, it was a big bump, but it was a bump. And, you know, at the end of the day, you know, keep that long term view, right? Because because, again, we talked about time, and you talked about debt, like the decisions I’m making today are based on time, like lenders come with to me with options and they go, you can have this rate, but you have a year window, or you can have this rate and you can have a four year window and I go I’ll pay the higher rate on what the four years, because in that case, you can buy time, right? I I will that’s that’s the thing that 2008 taught me, right? If I had been able to ride a two year window out at that time, I would be in a vastly different position. Right? And that’s, that’s really that’s really the lesson there is like guys like real estate, you just you can buy time. If you can buy yourself that time, you’re gonna be okay, most likely.

Derek Clifford 34:36
Yeah, I couldn’t agree more. And there’s a million reasons why commercial real estate is an incredible investment. And Tim and I could talk about it for a really long time, but there’s plenty of resources out there that you guys can look into to explore that including Tim’s social media feed. He’s got a ton of material out there so you can check that out and learn more about it. Now. A couple last points I want to make before we head into the wrap around and close up the show. is, you know, is there anything that you can say right now in the economy in terms of tap rates, demand inflation and rents in the coming near to mid term? And again, I’m not asking for a crystal ball. This is just your opinion. So for all you listeners out there, please understand that you should do your own due diligence here. But is there anything that you can say about commercial real estate, mainly for the the multifamily sector, since that’s the common thread that you and I have, and most of our listeners, anything you can say about what you’ve been learning recently that you can share with the audience?

Tim Vest 35:32
Um, yeah, I think what I would say is, in terms of like, kind of what we do, I think there’s still a little bit of speculation going on and, you know, with, with folks, we know around where rents are going, I think, I think guys have gotten really used to these huge rent bumps in the last few years. And I’m not here to say that they’re not going to continue. I’m totally not. I just knew at some point, there’s a point where people cry uncle, right. And I don’t know where that is. So that’s one of the things where I’m right now, if you’re asking where I’m being one of the most conservative, it’s on where rents will go. I think, I think we’re gonna continue to see 789 percent bumps for the next couple of years. But I’m not counting on it. And I’m my underwriting I’m more in the four to 5% range. And, you know, I think I think that’s one of the things I would say right now, if there’s one thing that makes me uneasy right now that I want people to be really, really cautious about it. So it’s on those rent escalation assumptions. I think it guys, there’s, there’s a ton of evidence out there and a ton of data out there that support that we’re going to continue to see huge pumps for the next little while. And I don’t disagree with that data, I would just say be cautious.

Derek Clifford 36:50
Yeah, I would agree with you, Tim. And also, as a limited partner, if you guys are looking to invest as a passive investor, check out those p&l projections, look and see where the rent projections are going. And then also cap compression, right. And watch for that make sure that whoever you’re looking you’re looking to partner with has a great exit strategy in mind, because some of the operators out there that have seen him are just counting on these increasing massive value, massive rent increases and cap compression in order to make a 25% IRR return in two years, right. Like I’m thinking, Arizona, you know, some of the some of the sunbelt states that have been seeing that type of growth, but I just be wary about it. Because you’re right. I think at some point, this is all going to stop. It’s going to slow down at least and so counting on that exit and not and then not being able to have that you could paint yourself in a really tough position because I’ve seen that happen already before and Austin as well recently so yeah,

Tim Vest 37:48
yeah, that’s a really good point because I think cap cap compression counting on cap compression is very very dangerous. I think you can we we when we underwrite we right? No matter the market, we write to Cat decompression. Now depending on where it is like a phoenix or say, a Raleigh, North Carolina, something like that, will write to a slightly slower cat decompression for markets like that, but always kept decompression.

Derek Clifford 38:17
Yeah, same thing here. We always expand our cap rate, I think we have a we use the SDA, the Michael blanc syndicated deal analysis, which is, which is a classic tool. And it’s really great, great thing to have. And I think what we do is we expand the cap rate, five basis points, I believe, every year that we hold, so for every dollar that we hold on, I’m not sure if that’s aggressive. It just depends on the market, too. But that’s usually where averages.

Tim Vest 38:45
Yeah, yeah. Sounds pretty good.

Derek Clifford 38:48
Yeah. Anyway, I probably could talk with you more about this stuff offline. But anyway, for sure. What I want to do now is I want to pivot over and again, I think we could we could talk about this stuff for days, no doubt. But we’re gonna head into our Rapid Round, which is the final part of the show here. And these questions that we ask every one of our guests are meant to be answered in a 32nd timeframe. And so if you’re ready, we’re just going to rapidly ask them to you.

Tim Vest 39:13
I will, I’ll try my best. Let’s go. All right. Okay,

Derek Clifford 39:17
Question number one. What book do you think has had the biggest impact on you and why? And we ask that it not be the Bible, or Rich Dad, Poor Dad or any of those books, because we get them all the time.

Tim Vest 39:29
Okay. Yeah, sure. So for me, I’ll just go with something recently actually ended that I’ve read it three times in the last year was who not how? Yeah. Now, that one’s been huge for me, simply because as my business is scaling, I’m having to find more who’s and start doing a little less how, and which is really tough for me, because I’m like, let me go look on Google and figure it out kind of guy. So yeah, who knows how.

Derek Clifford 39:54
That’s awesome. I think we may need to talk a little bit more about that. I’ve read the book a couple of times, but I also struggle with this too. So you’re a man of my own heart. Awesome. Yeah. Number two, if people want to emulate your success, what do you think is the first actionable thing that they could do to follow in your footsteps?

Tim Vest 40:12
To the very first thing is I would say, sit down, figure out a two year roadmap, put yourself on it. And so yes, for one thing, that’s it, sit down, figure out your two year roadmap, put yourself on it with steady progress towards it every day.

Derek Clifford 40:28
Love this. And by the way, folks that are listening, I know I’m expanding and probably going to break the 32nd rule here. But notice that Tim said two years, not 10. Two years is, at least in the circles that we run in is a very well defined quantifiable amount of time that gives you enough time and runway for you to make a major impact with a minimal amount of commitment each day, right? As long as it’s consistent. And I think where he’s gonna go with this is taking a two year goal, breaking it down into quarterly goals, and then weekly goals, and then even daily goals, right, and making it as quantifiable and easily checkable as possible. Right? It hopefully, I’m picking up on that right.

Tim Vest 41:10
No, you’re exactly right. And remember, it’s a Living, Breathing vague. So it’s a two year roadmap that’s constantly evolving based on where you go. And that’s why you have daily, weekly, quarterly as those are check ins. Those are check ins,

Derek Clifford 41:24
Bingo. Major, major. All right. Number three, what is one tool process or hack in the last three to six months that you’ve employed that can help save time and or effort? And it can be on the personal side? Or the business side?

Tim Vest 41:37
Yeah. So I would say, bringing on an assistant that has been that’s been the act, right, like getting help. Yes, Major earth shattering. Yeah, bringing on an assistant because there was just, there’s all this little stuff that I was doing that literally does not, does not make me money or move me towards my goals. That takes up a ton of time, and makes me less effective takes up that brain with right. So getting someone to take that from me.

Derek Clifford 42:08
Excellent. And just real quick, I know, again, we’re going to break the 32nd rule here. But how are you managing the workflow with that with that assistant, or with your assistants now?

Tim Vest 42:16
Yeah, so we sat down before we before we ever hired this person, we sat down with a list of things that we just we just listed out our day, right? Like, what do we do? And we started, if this did not get me towards this goal, specifically, we put a check beside it, and we added it to a list. And those are the things that we went to our system with and handed those things off. And then we have, and then we have regular check ins, weekly check ins on progress towards what she’s supposed to be doing.

Derek Clifford 42:49
Beautiful. And so just a little bit more clarity, because that’s the type of person I am. You did like a 15 minute interval for each hour on the hour and then listed out we did an average day or you actually logged it for like a week, or how did you how’d you get start with that?

Tim Vest 43:04
No, we actually logged it, we actually logged it. And then we went back and met and then I say we it’s one of my business partners, we actually went set, we logged it. And then we sat down and met and we said okay, let’s go through it and what’s missing? Or what shouldn’t be on the list. And actually, what we found is some things missing. Oh, we didn’t take anything off the list.

Derek Clifford 43:23
Awesome. Cool. Thank you for the insight, that process. Okay, number four, if the people that you know had to describe you with one word, what do you think that word would be? And why?

Tim Vest 43:32
Transparent? I guess I’ve been getting that a lot lately. I’m pretty if you’ve if you’ve seen my social media, you know, I’m pretty open about success, failures, struggles. You name it. I don’t kind of I don’t cover it up. In fact, I’m probably a little pessimistic or a little cautious of folks who do nothing but post wins. Yeah, yeah. So you know, I get a lot. I get it a lot, even from folks that I kind of coach and mentor is like, man, you really transparent. So I’ll go with that.

Derek Clifford 44:02
Yeah, I love that. That’s great. And by the way, guys, like that is a sign of someone who is comfortable with failure and success in the same hand. So I think the better that you can emulate him, so follow him on social media, see what he’s posting. Make sure you know that you start to get yourself more thinking like that, because clearly it is it is working wonders for him as well. All right, number five. What is one small thing that most people just don’t know about you?

Tim Vest 44:30
One small thing that people don’t know about me. Okay, so it was it will go. We’ll go with something a little bit funny here is I actually told Dustin Hoffman to shut up one time. No way. No way. Yeah, I didn’t know. I didn’t know. To be fair. I’ll explain it in 10 seconds or less. Right. I grew up around Southern pines, Pinehurst, they were in town filming this movie. I think it was called Hoffa, maybe. And there’s not much there’s nothing much to do in town there. So he and another guy were just at the movie theater. They were sitting in front of us. And they were talking. And I was just a little punk 17 year old guy, and I just leaned forward instead of saying, Could you please be quiet? I said, Would you shut up? And next thing, you know, Dustin Hoffman turned around and was like, Oh, I’m I’m sorry. I apologize.

Derek Clifford 45:23
What a great story. I bet you didn’t make that mistake again. But you didn’t tell anyone in the future after that to shut up.

Tim Vest 45:29
Yeah. Not that it was truly deserved, though.

Derek Clifford 45:36
How funny is that? Oh, my gosh. Wow, that I love that story. That’s amazing. Well, very cool. Tim. So I’ve had a blast talking with you on this podcast. It’s been amazing. And thank you so much for all these incredible nuggets of wisdom, which, by the way, we’ll be posting online all of the all the information here and taking snippets and all that great stuff. But before we go, why don’t you tell the audience a little bit more about how they can find you your investment opportunities? Or you know how in general they can keep in contact with what’s going on in your world?

Tim Vest 46:05
Yeah, so as always, you can reach out to me on social media, I’m on LinkedIn a lot on Facebook a little bit less, but I am their LinkedIn is probably the best spot. My website, harvestpg.com.Those are always good ways.

Derek Clifford 46:26
Excellent. Excellent. Well, Tim, thank you so much for coming on the show. This was amazing. I had such a great time.

Tim Vest 46:32
Hey, Derek, I appreciate it. Thanks. It’s been great.

Derek Clifford 46:35
Awesome, awesome. And for you listeners who have listened to all the way to this point in the podcast. First of all, thank you so much for your listenership. And wherever you are listening or watching the podcast, please make sure you Like Subscribe, interact comment with us, because the more that we do that we start appeasing those algorithm gods and the algorithm Gods will then help us get connected with more people like you listeners, and also incredible guests and continue to help get keep the show up on the airwaves. So thank you for that. And Tim, once again, thanks for coming on. Really appreciate you being here. Everyone. This is Derek, I’m signing off. We’ll see you next week. Take care!